Name:
ValuePropositionOfInformationStandardsEspeciallyAroundAPAC Countries
Description:
ValuePropositionOfInformationStandardsEspeciallyAroundAPAC Countries
Thumbnail URL:
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Duration:
T00H32M56S
Embed URL:
https://stream.cadmore.media/player/0881fd64-07f2-4568-8ed6-0bc3029294a8
Content URL:
https://cadmoreoriginalmedia.blob.core.windows.net/0881fd64-07f2-4568-8ed6-0bc3029294a8/ValuePropositionOfInformationStandardsEspeciallyAroundAPAC C.mp4?sv=2019-02-02&sr=c&sig=ZzkT68s7fmWyYL%2FF7RebgAn%2BPSPxhDaRbq8FpVCNVOI%3D&st=2024-10-25T18%3A48%3A13Z&se=2024-10-25T20%3A53%3A13Z&sp=r
Upload Date:
2024-03-06T00:00:00.0000000
Transcript:
Language: EN.
Segment:0 .
Hello good morning. Good afternoon. Good evening. I'm sure all of those apply. Oh, aren't you? Are you there, chris? Good let's just wait for everyone to come in, especially Jesse. He's yes, I can see him coming in there, too.
I'd like to actually try something. A little different with this session, which is to maybe organize the discussion, the topics. Beforehand, so to speak, using a mirror board. So I've just popped into the chat. A link to the Board which you should be able to get into. And my idea here is to, first of all, capture and prioritize the topics and questions that we want to put to our speakers and also for broader discussion and then spend.
Hopefully we'll have a good 20 minutes for that. And then at the end, identify some key takeaways. So I can see this. I hope I can see. People joining. Let me know if that link is not working though. You should be able to pop your name in as well. But that is optional and you certainly don't need to give them your email address if you don't want to.
You can click past that part. And what I have this is where the topics are. So you should have the ability to put in sticky note so you can put in your own note, choose whichever wonderful color you want, and then just pop some questions in. Or they can just be topics.
I've got an example one in there. So it looks like there is an error message. So let me regenerate a link. Thanks, Daisy, for letting me know about that. Oh, looks like most people are in, but I'll regenerate the link again for Daisy. Try that one again, Daisy, for you.
I can see other people are in there and are busily working away. And then what will happen is after, let's say, another 3 minutes, we'll will vote on the notes that are up there and then we can take them in order of the interest that's been shown in them.
Well, it looks like. I'm sorry that it's not working for you, Daisy. It looks, as you can see on the screen, everyone else seems to be in. Tell you what. If you can just message yours to me, I can pop it in for you.
And also Sarah has reminded us we also have the shared Google Doc too. So we can also add our thoughts there as well. It's a good tip from the other Chris.
Incognito windows. I find work wonders. Get rid of your cookies as well. That could help. OK I think we've got a nice set here.
So let me try and hopefully. Yeah, there's your voting area and we're doing sticky notes. I'm giving everyone, let's say how many topics do we have to four. Seven so let's give you seven votes that you can spread around as you please. And so you can have time to digest. Let's give us 3 minutes as well. So the voting has started.
Votes are anonymous, so people will not be. Well, the questions are anonymous to. So vote. Oh, good. I'm glad you got in, Daisy. Wow you had to parse the url, it looks like. OK I'm voting on a separate account that you can't see.
OK about a minute left or I will end it early if it indicates that most people have cast their votes. But it looks like we still got two or three folks, so we'll give them the full minute if they need it.
The countdown is very helpful when I do this with students to make sure that they are incentivized to participate. OK the results are about to be revealed. Ooh wow. Fancy well, I don't just want the top three. I want to see all the results. It looks like our first one is a question for Andrew, actually.
So lucky you. What kind? It's a bit small there, so I'll read it out. What kind of standard or metadata did you use for cataloging Andrew, before this new standard? And what's the biggest change and challenge? Before we implemented our XML model, we just had our home grown database that held our metadata about our standards.
So the common elements title, designation, publishing date, those sort of or data points are all there and they're really easy to move across. It's when you start to look at more richer information that you'd like to capture, that that's where you're using a standard is in that rich area is better. Obviously, having the data points in a standardized markup means when we give the information to other users, it's more predictable, it's less sort of coming out of a bespoke database.
So with you've always got challenges when you move from one day to set to another with, you know, mapping of data 1 to 1, mapping easy for everybody, one too many challenging, and then opening up the field to enrich your data. That's it's just a world of new possibilities. I think that's what you've got. An example I can think of, there is the mockup that we're just exploring at the moment in the XSS schema around capturing keywords.
And you can be quite rich using what's available in the schema to have keywords that are taken from a fixed vocabulary set. And you can identify those. And so you can, you can layer in and that's a good example of what's better in the new world. And you can't backwards translate that particularly effectively because that all that richness wasn't available in the pre earlier ISO model. And then we didn't really think about that.
We weren't even at that stage of identifying AI data with keywords and properly in our originating database. So yeah, there's, there are some of the issues with that in terms of a standard for metadata. What's interesting is that we actually have to ISO and IEC have harmonized model for their metadata and we don't use it. We try and shoehorn a lot of that data into metadata that's relevant at the time of publication and that's the ISO is good for other metadata where we just sort of bit freewheeling and we have that in XML, but in a homegrown part of the standard.
And so there's the. Other types of metadata that are a bit more business specific. We haven't really explored how to standardize those and we're inventing as we go on an as needed basis using XML as a framework. But it's how we do it is pretty ad hoc and this is coming from my head which could be dangerous. So and I see that Todd has his question.
I see that Todd has something to supplement. Go ahead, Todd. No, actually, I have a question for you, Andrew. It's related. Are you exploring as a source? But I can put that on my list so I will have a look. So that's the nice, standard specific ontology for standards.
Oh, the ontology standards. Yes yes. That that I've looked at. And that's a great vocabulary set for the standardization processes and getting ourselves to producing standards documents. But so those that ontology is great for that, but these are other descriptors of the content that we need to capture as metadata as opposed to describing the processes of creating the document.
OK so so you're talking about sort of subject specific. Yep and uses helping people. One of the big issues is finding relevance stat. So how the heck do we do that? So exploring the key wording and rich key wording, that's, that's something we, we've started looking at. But the other.
And then commercial metadata for product and pricing for selling the stuff and managing that side of things. OK Thanks. Thanks for. On that topic. Yeah in terms of our next question topic, we have three questions that all got eight. So I'll use my discretion as the moderator to pick the one I had my on, which is, how can we best drive adoption of pids in apac?
This the questioner put specifically outside of Australia and New Zealand. But I don't know, maybe we can include, include the Aussies and the kiwis in that too. But this is a question. Well, in my experience, I had an experience at our University of trying to just drive the adoption of orchid, which was it's still ongoing. It's a multi-year process.
But I think. Jessie, would you like to speak to this question? Because I think it's an important one. Yes yes. So actually so we also do a lot of training and promotion about kids in our University. So either we promote or key or other authority, such as capacity and also society. But I think the important thing is we should raise the awareness of our scholars, say they should use it and what kind of benefit they will get from using the.
OK and also, I think still a lot of scholar or researcher they have some do not understanding the functions on the benefit for the pids. Recently I received an inquiry from one professor in my University. So they just think about well, OK, well also display laws record about the article get rejected by some general loss like also this display if is OK profile so I just convey slant or display lost record.
So I think we still need to release or promote our pids in our campus to let our scholars know the benefits and the they will start to use it. I actually didn't know that ORCID could do that display rejections from publishers as well. But yeah, just that, that sort of basic stuff that you, you know, your ORCID record is your own and you can go in and hide whatever you want. You know, that's a big thing with ORCID is that the researcher has full control.
Yes Andrew, is there anything you wanted to add to that? Or indeed, we can open it up to other folks. That's I guess we don't use enough persistent identifier for standard Australia rather than unique designations. So that's as close as we come in our own. So it's a slightly different domain, I guess that all our documents have a unique identifier as a publisher that's essential.
But the breadth of materials that libraries, and other publishers are disseminating, that's a much bigger question. I guess it's promoting the use of them, I guess is really selling the value of discoverability. Yeah, that's my case. Discoverability and that that is a big question for everybody. Thank you, Todd.
Your hand is up again. I can't resist. So take this question simply as one doesn't know what one doesn't know. And I hope I do know, but I'm wondering if there is are there any persistent identifiers in wide use in the apac region, you know, for author identification for institutional identification that.
Like we're not aware of or we should be more aware of. You know, I know there's a lot of discussion about ORCID and raw, etc., but my question is, I'm wondering is, are there similar kind of homegrown identifiers in the apac region that maybe have an installed base that we just aren't thinking of, that people are using, that just use this as an opportunity to say, hey, is there something we don't know?
Good question. I can't think of anything, although there's much that I don't know. Yes, I, I don't think so. I don't think we have any new IP IDs in Hong Kong or in China, so we don't have those kind of new kids here. Yeah, but in my University so so we are quite rely on school outside actually.
Yeah that's interesting. Andrew, what were you going to say? The only cognate I can think of is in the banking sector. So there's ISO standards that setup data exchange protocols, and then so each bank has a unique identifier. So that stems out of an ISO standard. Which one? I can't remember at the moment. But yes, there's such a financial incentive in that sector how we can get universities to adopt the same and who would control it.
And management becomes the big question. Oh, no. Yeah, there are dozens of institutional identifiers. I was just you know, I'm happy to hear that there aren't any that we're not aware of. And there are things that people are using or developing that we're not aware of. But it's always good to just ask and double check, definitely. Although there might be additional challenges with identifying individual offers and having an ID for an individual authors, that steps into what's increasingly an area of personal information that you'd have to tread carefully around national laws relating to those.
OK, let's take one of the other topics. I think Chris has his hand up. You just can't see it because. Oh, don't. Oh, sorry. Yes oh, because of your wonderful thing on your background. It blends in very well with the icon.
Chris, please go ahead. Yeah, I was just going to say, to answer Todd's question, there is kind of a national system in Japan called research map that's fairly comprehensive. So it's quite difficult to get any traction there. And this was my question, and I didn't mean to be exclusionary with Australia and New Zealand, but at least from the ORCID perspective, adoption, ORCID adoption is really good in Australia and New Zealand, but certainly in particularly South East Asia.
I don't everybody has any insight into, into those countries where I think, you know, research is important from a kind of a government national priorities point of view. But we maybe just don't have the network to kind of make contacts and have those discussions. So feel free to kind of ping me if you're aware of anything. I have any contacts there afterwards that would be really helpful.
No, I was just thinking after attending a session yesterday in Hong Kong, while Jessie, maybe we need to work on this because every University is using ORCID and RCC has this requirement. We still don't have a not national that we don't have a regional consortia in Hong Kong. And that's something that's always been very strange to me. We never figured that out, despite all of us being heavy users and promoters of ORCID individually.
So that's something we can follow up on. Chris, maybe you can help us with that conversation. Absolutely Yeah. Yeah I wanted to go to this one of backwards compatibility because I thought that was quite interesting how to address this issue of backwards compatibility with standards. And Andrew, you've already spoken a bit about this. This is one of the challenges that you faced.
But do you do you have any other do you want to develop that those thoughts in more detail? We you really have to understand it. Sometimes it's on an element by element basis and about what level richness you are adding in that may or may not be backwards compatible or you. You can work at clutches so you could remove a tag from its nice semantic meaning and just dump it in as a paragraph or text is one way of sending it backwards.
So there are ways to do it and you'd have to explore those there. The value to end user community of that. Maybe it depends on your market too. You could encourage people to speed up their hold your data with that in your new state and you offer it backwards as a choice, the recipient of the data and then when they upgrade, they can take an updated copy of it and get the full benefit of the new.
So that's the strategy we are employing. And if it's really valuable stuff, that's a total incentive, incentivizes them to upgrade as quickly as possible. Thanks, Andrew. Is there any. Anyone else want to say anything here? If not our.
Next question. Are there concerns within the APC community about engaging with the standards development process in general? I guess the question is, how can we build greater involvement? And I. Yeah before volunteering for this session, I didn't know too much about standards or certainly the development process in general. So is this something we need or how can we get more people involved with this?
I guess Andrew or Jessie or indeed anyone else. Thoughts? or. Recommendations, suggestions, these panaceas, no sorts of problems to that promotion, bring awareness of standards and the role that they can play so that the talk that our cocktail and of the other day from the speaker from the UAE is solving incredible and making it compelling competing products internationally by following standards.
I mean, that is the whole selling of the value of centralization, particularly in a trade more trading economy. That's that's step one. Availability standards models depends on people's volunteering their time in the vast majority of cases. So that's going to depend on so many economic factors of people's ability to participate.
So that can be great but going to be also a barrier to participation. We are coming from this end of the world. Participation internationally is hampered by time zones. Let me say those who live in the northern hemisphere are not often very good at. Dealing with those of us who are in other time zones. So meetings are very often this is a great example of a counter example, but meetings are often held at nearly impossible times for our brains to function meaningfully.
And there's the cost, depending on your economy. And are you working for travel? And face to face meetings obviously are superior for many reasons, but they can be cost prohibitive. So those sorts of barriers to. No I think that makes having virtual meetings, virtual meetings that all the players agree to some degree of discomfort in time zone.
But compromise and compromise on the discomfort is one thing that makes me would be valuable. No, I think that's a great suggestion. Any other. Hard any? No just. Just kind of building on that. Yeah time zones is obviously an issue.
You know, as someone who does a lot of ISO meetings, you know, between. 7 and midnight or starting at 3 AM Eastern for the Europeans who start at 9. You know, I completely understand. And I. Recognize how. Particularly people in the US are very, you know.
Inflexible when it comes to, you know, the world should revolve around us, which is problematic and is part of the reason why we're doing this. This conference, the way we do this is to encourage involvement and engagement. I'm just wondering if there are other reasons apart from time zones, if we even if we had all of our meetings now and made all the Europeans suffer.
I'm wondering if to your question, to your statement, Andrew, if there's also an awareness. Issue and how can we overcome that awareness issue? You know, in the library community and scholarly community that we would love to have different perspectives coming into these problems and these questions and how do we build that participation.
And time zones are comparatively easy to address. But you know, how do we build awareness and build? The desire to participate. As for me, if I didn't participate in this conference, I would have zero understanding, I think, of a lot of these issues. So I think ISO can be our ISO Plus.
This is one way, but obviously that's been running for several years now. So how can we further extend and promote that within our communities? Short and sweet. Some use cases of the benefits that you can obtain from not only using standards, but then participating in the creation and sharing across organizations that are participating.
Their costs and benefits have the cost, savings, etc., and benefits, I mean, using money, but that speaks and having that ready to go. So so when you're interested, people are on the cusp or have haven't heard about it in the first place. There's a short and easy, digestible series of examples from the age of organizations. So that you get the power.
Sort of case studies. All right. We've still got. Oh, oh, sorry. Go ahead. To follow up on that as a concrete. Potential action item drive towards action.
Are there people on the call who might be willing to participate in a. You know, a pilot of like developing case studies for how standards have been helping your institution or even institutions that you're affiliated with or know or friends with, you know, whomever that we could work with to pull some of those case studies together.
And not to put anyone on the spot. You can ping me later, but I think that that might be an interesting potential. Yeah especially if they were from the region. Right and we're a little bit more they could connect with, with what was going on in those examples. Yeah like some of the things that Jesse was talking about during his.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah speaking of which, we're running up on the end of our time and. Well, I don't want to. Kind of supersede the shared Google doc, but there's also a space on the mirror board to put your key takeaway.
But and this, of course, the board will stay up after the meeting is concluded. So no rush here. But it would be pretty interesting if everyone could put their sort of key takeaway from today's session and just pop that in their. And I'll send that over, of course, to the nice folks along with the rest of the board content. But since we are coming up on 945, are there any last minute final questions for andrew?
Jesse for. Anyone else on the call. If not, I'll give you a break before the final keynote, which I'm very much looking forward to. Thanks again so much to Andrew and Jesse for speaking at this session and to the organizers and sponsors, of course, as well.
So thank you and see you next time. Great thank you. Thank you.